Template Monster: Public Service Announcement

2 kim:

I uploaded again .zip file of theme with 766px .body style width.
Thinking it was not a "small fix", we tested this theme, and talked about fluid designs above. That’s why we coded the theme in such way: to change width of all theme, you must edit only one line in CSS.

And I want to talk about template setup after theme files copied and it was selected.

there are 2 ways to make it's look like our in demo:

1. provide list of admin setting customer ought to change (from 20 to 50 settings) it will take several minutes to setup it in this way.

2. provide SQL file (it must be installed only ONE time, or sideboxes will be duplicated) - easy setup, but... you don't like it.

Are there any other ways?

So what is the verdict here from the ZC community at large?

And to the TM representatives, I see the same templates you offer also offered on several different sites, are these all satellites of your company?

stage

Hmmm. Think I'll have a go at both questions> stage:

So what is the verdict here from the ZC community at large?Good intentions leading to big improvements and but still some way to go.

stage:

And to the TM representatives, I see the same templates you offer also offered on several different sites, are these all satellites of your company?TM has a well-structured affiliate program, so these are independent affiliates rather than satellites.

stage:

So what is the verdict here from the ZC community at large?
As just a poster/supporter here - A source for well designed tremplates that are designed within the Zen Cart structure and alllow full functionality or are well documented as to what can not be utilized would be a GREAT benefit to both parties, as Zen Cart users are not always designers and only desire to operate an online business.

Todate, TM templates generally do not allow simple manipulation of the settings within the admin and/or are not designed wih the normal tags or valiadatable code.

fellis:

And I want to talk about template setup after theme files copied and it was selected.

there are 2 ways to make it's look like our in demo:

1. provide list of admin setting customer ought to change (from 20 to 50 settings) it will take several minutes to setup it in this way.

2. provide SQL file (it must be installed only ONE time, or sideboxes will be duplicated) - easy setup, but... you don't like it.

Are there any other ways?
As for the SQL file ... Using a distribution SQL file to apply required changes is usually the better approach, especially when a lot of settings need to be altered.

The comments below are based on the ZENCART_SHORT.SQL file in the zen_new.zip link posted earlier in this thread.

1. The updates to configuration_key entries in the configuration table are probably fine.

2. The direct insertion of "template_tm_new" entries in the layout_boxes table without removing existing entries for that template ... creates duplicates. Why not just do an update or an insert only if the desired entry doesn't already exist for the boxes you need for the given template?
   I suspect you don't plan to name all your templates as "template_tm_new", but rather will be naming them according to the template distribution name/number.

3. The removal and recreation of the entire "banners" table, and then the re-population of it with defaults all turned off and then adding one new one ... is ... not very efficient, and rather destructive. What if someone had created their own banners? I'm sure they'd not be very happy with you.
   Why not just ADD your OWN NEW banner entry, and provide instructions about what to do with existing ones?
   In fact, if you create your own new banner with a new unique banner group code, and only use that group when displaying banners in special places in your template, then you'd be far further ahead with the modular Zen Cart methodology.

4. EZ-Pages. You did the same with EZ-Pages as you did for banners ... wiped all existing entries and then re-added defaults plus your own, with a few settings changed. Not a nice practice. poof there goes all the customer's previous work.
   Again, why not just ADD your own, and leave the existing ones intact ... allowing the customer to do the appropriate cleanup?
   If your layout is busted by their own EZ-Pages content, then ... you probably need to fix your layout.

The idea is ... be as non-intrusive as possible, while making activation of the template as easy as possible. Wiping out existing data ... is not professional.
Granted, it's still wise to advise them to do database and file backups before installing, and to test to be sure their backup/restore activities can be easily used.

Well....just as a customer of TM....I am still waiting on a fix for my ZC template. I was promised it would be fixed in 12 hours and that was several days ago. I would tell you to not buy any TM templates (ZC ones) until they get it fixed.

Talk is cheap. I first opened the ticket on 6/20. I'm glad I bought 2 templates. What a deal!!!!

Scott :censored:

It has been a few weeks ago that I bought a template from Template Monster. I posted before that I had a few issues with my template too.

My postings lead to individual contact with TM. Two days ago I felt a little 'hurrah' coming up: I got a message if it was ok that they solve my issues within 24 hrs. If I couldn't wait any longer 'then please let us know'.

I answered back that they can work on it until upcoming Monday, but that I really needs to be finished then as I already informed customers/banks etc. about the new website.

I am getting a little scared here as I do not see any progress (nobody is accessing my site -they got full access- nothing has been changed). If my site isn't working soon I have a HUGE problem... :-(

The only message I receive is that they're terribly sorry, but that someone else needs to fix the problems...

I thought being understanding and giving them extra time would result in proper solutions, but unfortunately it isn't so... :-(

I just purchased a template from TM. I even read this thread prior to buying one, I was put off - but I still went ahead. I am pelased I did.

I think a lot of people here expect to much to be done already - I am a web devloper and I used zencart for a quick and easy shop for my mum - it's amazing - the amoutn of functionality from a programmers perspective is incredibel and it's free. I think this is why people feel spending $150+ should get them somethign easier. WRONG. design is tedious - especially incorporating it into a dynamic website.

People DONT be put off be these comments if you know how to work a little bit with PHP and CSS and you are interested in purchasing one.

To templatemonster I would suggest one thing - I am on a windows server and PHP doesn't support shorthand tags <?= ?> and <? ?>. It was an easy fix but worth noting.

Thank you.

kgooding:

I would suggest one thing - I am on a windows server and PHP doesn't support shorthand tags <?= ?> and <? ?>. It was an easy fix but worth noting.Yes, good point. That is another very important concept that anyone involved in writing/customizing PHP files/code should note.

Using the shorthand tags is fine for ad hoc coding on your own private server. But if you're selling code to customers, or sharing your work with others, it's really a dangerous practice to use shorthand tags.
(Been there, done that, got the "stumped for a week and embarrassed" t-shirt).

Stick with the full <?php tag instead.

kgooding:

To templatemonster I would suggest one thing - I am on a windows server and PHP doesn't support shorthand tags <?= ?> and <? ?>. It was an easy fix but worth noting.

Thank you.

DrByte:

Yes, good point. That is another very important concept that anyone involved in writing/customizing PHP files/code should note.

Using the shorthand tags is fine for ad hoc coding on your own private server. But if you're selling code to customers, or sharing your work with others, it's really a dangerous practice to use shorthand tags.
(Been there, done that, got the "stumped for a week and embarrassed" t-shirt).

Stick with the full <?php tag instead.

:smile:Thanks for the insight, will keep that in mind from here on out!

kgooding,

People DONT be put off be these comments if you know how to work a little bit with PHP and CSS and you are interested in purchasing one.
This is exactly one of the major issues!!! No where does the TM site state that one must know how to work with php to use their templates...

Most that have the real issues are ones that just want to run their store and a major reason that they do not just code their own template and prefer to "buy" one that they envision is compatible as this is what is stated, only to find out that many items do not function as expected.

kgooding:

I just purchased a template from TM. I even read this thread prior to buying one, I was put off - but I still went ahead. I am pelased I did.

I think a lot of people here expect to much to be done already - I am a web devloper and I used zencart for a quick and easy shop for my mum - it's amazing - the amoutn of functionality from a programmers perspective is incredibel and it's free. I think this is why people feel spending $150+ should get them somethign easier. WRONG. design is tedious - especially incorporating it into a dynamic website.

People DONT be put off be these comments if you know how to work a little bit with PHP and CSS and you are interested in purchasing one.

To templatemonster I would suggest one thing - I am on a windows server and PHP doesn't support shorthand tags <?= ?> and <? ?>. It was an easy fix but worth noting.

Thank you.

We did the same thing, read the comments here and still ended purchasing one of the TM templates. I am also a developer so I felt even if it needed some work I could likely handle it. That did prove to be the case, and after a couple of days work, I've to get most things the way we want them.

All that being said I do not have an overly favorable impression of TM. I found some areas to be sloppy. For example several of the changes required had to do with the differences between IE and Firefox, that was out of the box which tells me that either they didn't test the template in all browsers or they didn't care that there were issues.

A couple of the page, most notably the orders history page and the downloads page were awful out of the box and had to have major work done to them.

I'm all for encouraging people to learn and have a passion to mentor people who have that desire. But my expectations are that a $30 template might be one someone would purchase for a learning experience but not one that cost $150.

Also prior to purchase I did contact their live chat support to ask a couple of general questions. Lets just say I would not count that as a benefit of buying one of their templates.

Overall the template now looks pretty nice after putting a significant amount of effort into it. TM I think you owe your customers a little more effort on your part.

stage

The templates are offered to a HUGE!! let me repeat that, HUGE amounts of people ... Therefore they're pretty generalized in functionality.

They won't work the way "everyone" wants them too, or expects. Everyone isn't everyone.

Their appeal is obviously from a design approach because functionality is horrible. They have enough satisfied customers to "move" on to the next one ya know ...

If you ask for help, you'll get it ... but who knows when. There isn't a "Zen Cart" department at TM so you run in line with the million other support requests ...

All in All - if your looking for good functionality & design, and of course your not capable of achieving that yourself - which if your here you took a step in the right direction, look into getting zen customization. There are tons of so called, "Zenners" out there.

testuser:

The templates are offered to a HUGE!! let me repeat that, HUGE amounts of people ... Therefore they're pretty generalized in functionality.

They won't work the way "everyone" wants them too, or expects. Everyone isn't everyone.

Their appeal is obviously from a design approach because functionality is horrible. They have enough satisfied customers to "move" on to the next one ya know ...

If you ask for help, you'll get it ... but who knows when. There isn't a "Zen Cart" department at TM so you run in line with the million other support requests ...

All in All - if your looking for good functionality & design, and of course your not capable of achieving that yourself - which if your here you took a step in the right direction, look into getting zen customization. There are tons of so called, "Zenners" out there.Wow. If that's the conclusion of somebody who has been working with them, then all the concerns expressed in this thread are fully justified.

If I understand you correctly, you're saying that TM is about templates with poor functionality that look good so that they can be shifted in high volumes to people who don't know any better, a lack of specialist or even adequately staffed support, and you're recommending that people not use them if they want something that both looks good and works.

Until now I had been given TMonster the benefit of the doubt, believing that his desire to improve this situation was genuine. Should I conclude from your comments that this is not so.

kuroi:

Wow. If that's the conclusion of somebody who has been working with them, then all the concerns expressed in this thread are fully justified.

If I understand you correctly, you're saying that TM is about templates with poor functionality that look good so that they can be shifted in high volumes to people who don't know any better, a lack of specialist or even adequately staffed support, and you're recommending that people not use them if they want something that both looks good and works.

Until now I had been given TMonster the benefit of the doubt, believing that his desire to improve this situation was genuine. Should I conclude from your comments that this is not so.

Let's not throw gas on the fire :yuck: my comments are merely my perception ... I just happen to see and believe it to be a fact.

I was assisting them in trying to "get-it-right" ... some are hard-headed.

Any design can be turned into a functional Zen Cart. Nothing's impossible if your willing to put forth the effort. Some people like simplicity with the ability to replicate, while others thrive on traffic!

Far be it from me to stir :D, but you have been working much more closely with with Template Monster than the rest of us and have generally been supportive of them. If you shift your position as a result of those experiences, and express that change publicly, then I have to listen to and respect those perceptions.

I agree that virtually any design can be turned into a functional Zen Cart, indeed it is possible to do virtually anything with Zen Cart, one of the joys of Open Source and a well-structured architecture. But we also need to recognise that most people who go to Template Monster do so because they're not designers and/or developers and they want something that will work for them with just the minimum of customization. Sometimes it's not just effort that's needed, but also skills and knowledge, and for most Zenners the objective isn't to get a site up, it's to extend or launch a business. The site is the means to rather than the end itself and shouldn't become the main focus (other than of course for us sad old web pros :wink:)

kuroi:

If you shift your position as a result of those experiences, and express that change publicly, then I have to listen to and respect those perceptions.

My views haven't changed a bit. And I've had no bad experiences with them, or purchased a template from them.

It was just time someone said what everyone was thinking. It's really common sense to figure out the approach. Simple to replicate yet appealing ... but they're a template site ... so there in again what's wrong with what they're doing.

Maybe they'll find out they can't mix simplicity with design AND be able to replicate them without them all looking somewhat similar. The strategies get a bit complex. Then you have support request out the waaaaaaazoo cause everyone assumed it was compatible.

There are just to many whatifs and I was just stating my opinon. :lamo:

testuser:

My views haven't changed a bit. And I've had no bad experiences with them, or purchased a template from them.

Your posts (with great confidence) imply that you are or have been a customer and know much about Template Monster the company. Then you post the quoted text above. Confused. :blink: Feel free to throw your opinions in the mix here, but let's clarify for the benefit of others reading this thread...Are you or have you been a customer of Template Monster? Are you directly affiliated with Template Monster?

As for to competence level of those purchasing a template from TM or any other, I'd venture to say that in most cases it is someone interested in running a business and not being a programmer/designer. So the template should function without the need to learn programming. Most people that buy a car are not mechanics. :wink:

the simple fact is this,

THE DAMN THINGS DONT WORK OUT OF THE BOX,

if you flip a switch ON in the admin you shouldnt have to worry about what its going to break.

most of the folks that go to TM dont have the first clue,
they see that it is suposed to work with Zen Cart and but it,

then findout that they have to fix it to work , now they have already blown their entire design budget and have to figure out which meals to skip to payu someone to fix it.

lets put this in a much more realistic perspective......

you buy a new lock for your front door, get home and put it all in,

looks GOOOOOOOOOOD......

now try the key, hmm it dosnt work, take the lock back to the store, they wont take it back because its been opened.....

you have a few choices,
you can
1 throw it away and call it lesson learned
2 re-key it IF you know how
3 call a locksmith to re-key it

now your upset because it didnt work right out of the box

Im not a locksmith, Are you?